Lately immigration has been a warmer subject to this blog, and the the other blog where I write. I have extolled the value to America of immigration of those who WISH to be Americans.
In another of the series of talks we have had which has had it's highs and lows - frank recognition of the difficulties engendered by a religious founding doc which must be regarded as the perfect uncreated word, and recommendations for us to read intros to Islam by utterly dhimmified fools, last night we had a discussion of the experience of Muslims in America.
I am going to lay it out dispassionately.
The word CAIR was never mentioned.
There are some aspects and suggestions in the objective data (all from Pew) that at this point Muslims in the USA, 2/3 of whom, are 1st generation immigrants that we may be seeing just what was present in other 1st generation groups.
Consider this.
Of the 35% native born muslims, the vast majority, converts to Islam are actually the folks who used to be the Nation of Islam but were brought into the maintream of Sunni Islam by the son of Elijah Muhammad.
One huge difference between those who came here as muslims and earlier waves (though the numbers are too small to call this a wave, this prof estimated about 1.5 million) is education level. Here in a america, among measured religious groups only jews have a higher college graduate percentage.
71% of Muslim Americans agree that most people who
want to get ahead in the U.S. can make it if they are willing to work hard.
78% are happy or very happy with their lives.
In the mid 40%'s they would tell other muslims coming to assimilate, in the mid 20%'s they would say, don't.
(I canot find numbers like this for the early 20th century groupings)
Here is a VERY INTERESTING ITEM.... look at the first line and then the last. In a first generation group of immigrants I wonder if any of the southern europeans, or jews would have polled much differently.
Or maybe we should all be alarmed that very low numbers think of themselves as american first.
Of those muslims who thought of themselves as americans first, a two thirds hardly go to mosque, a few days a year ... in other words the equivalent of Easter-Xmas or Jewish High Holidays.
Of those who think of themselves as muslims first, 74% go never to a few times.
????????
Since we had an open discussion which had been announced we had one muslima (covered) and 4 gusy show up from U Maine.
They seemd quite relaxed and had some questions and did not seem reticent to ask and take part.
Of course the subject of Israel never came up in discussion except to say that an astonishing 61% of muslims here believe that peace can be reached there. I said nothing.
Data for Europe is very dismal compared to the USA. There is little assimilation or hope for it. Earnings data shows them pitifully behind. I remarked as how across 1900 years assimilation for jews in europe did not go too well either.
After the occasion we hade tea, dessert, and soda. The crowd mixed easily. This congregation is essentially professional people, either professors at the university, or medical and legal people. The muslims who came along were right in that milieu.
Perhaps that explains the vast majority of muslims here more than anything else.
While we were in discussions with some I notice others, praying in the rabbi's office. They asked only for a place. I saw the door close so I got it, but it was a truly remarkable moment, if incongruous.
Soon I hope to have Dr. Bostom up here, and bring a crow like dose of reality to some of this. While we are far from the center of things, CAIR is real, the Muslim Brotherhood is real, and we all know that movements are created with a small number of actors who have broad unstated support. But it is just as important to be sure we also know it is not all HAMAS and Qaradawi, and recognize that we may skirt by some problems because the big party known as America is just too pretty to resist, ALL the time.
Maybe.
The data give one warning, but it is one true across all religions in america right now .. younger people take religion much more seriously. I am one who has differentiated Islam because of the Quran being mandatorily taken as the perfect word of a perfect being, so HERE is something to mull about the attitude of americans who happen to be muslim.
In another of the series of talks we have had which has had it's highs and lows - frank recognition of the difficulties engendered by a religious founding doc which must be regarded as the perfect uncreated word, and recommendations for us to read intros to Islam by utterly dhimmified fools, last night we had a discussion of the experience of Muslims in America.
I am going to lay it out dispassionately.The word CAIR was never mentioned.
There are some aspects and suggestions in the objective data (all from Pew) that at this point Muslims in the USA, 2/3 of whom, are 1st generation immigrants that we may be seeing just what was present in other 1st generation groups.
Consider this.
Of the 35% native born muslims, the vast majority, converts to Islam are actually the folks who used to be the Nation of Islam but were brought into the maintream of Sunni Islam by the son of Elijah Muhammad.
One huge difference between those who came here as muslims and earlier waves (though the numbers are too small to call this a wave, this prof estimated about 1.5 million) is education level. Here in a america, among measured religious groups only jews have a higher college graduate percentage.
71% of Muslim Americans agree that most people who
want to get ahead in the U.S. can make it if they are willing to work hard.
78% are happy or very happy with their lives.
In the mid 40%'s they would tell other muslims coming to assimilate, in the mid 20%'s they would say, don't.
(I canot find numbers like this for the early 20th century groupings)
Here is a VERY INTERESTING ITEM.... look at the first line and then the last. In a first generation group of immigrants I wonder if any of the southern europeans, or jews would have polled much differently.
Or maybe we should all be alarmed that very low numbers think of themselves as american first.
Of those muslims who thought of themselves as americans first, a two thirds hardly go to mosque, a few days a year ... in other words the equivalent of Easter-Xmas or Jewish High Holidays.
Of those who think of themselves as muslims first, 74% go never to a few times.
????????
Since we had an open discussion which had been announced we had one muslima (covered) and 4 gusy show up from U Maine.
They seemd quite relaxed and had some questions and did not seem reticent to ask and take part.
Of course the subject of Israel never came up in discussion except to say that an astonishing 61% of muslims here believe that peace can be reached there. I said nothing.
Data for Europe is very dismal compared to the USA. There is little assimilation or hope for it. Earnings data shows them pitifully behind. I remarked as how across 1900 years assimilation for jews in europe did not go too well either.
After the occasion we hade tea, dessert, and soda. The crowd mixed easily. This congregation is essentially professional people, either professors at the university, or medical and legal people. The muslims who came along were right in that milieu.
Perhaps that explains the vast majority of muslims here more than anything else.
While we were in discussions with some I notice others, praying in the rabbi's office. They asked only for a place. I saw the door close so I got it, but it was a truly remarkable moment, if incongruous.
Soon I hope to have Dr. Bostom up here, and bring a crow like dose of reality to some of this. While we are far from the center of things, CAIR is real, the Muslim Brotherhood is real, and we all know that movements are created with a small number of actors who have broad unstated support. But it is just as important to be sure we also know it is not all HAMAS and Qaradawi, and recognize that we may skirt by some problems because the big party known as America is just too pretty to resist, ALL the time.
Maybe.
The data give one warning, but it is one true across all religions in america right now .. younger people take religion much more seriously. I am one who has differentiated Islam because of the Quran being mandatorily taken as the perfect word of a perfect being, so HERE is something to mull about the attitude of americans who happen to be muslim.
1 comment:
Mulsims praying in a Rabbi's office?
Heh, only in America. :)
Seems like the best group out of those polled are, college educated, over 55 and arrived before 1990.
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