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The Right of the People to be Secure in their Persons, Houses, Papers, and Effects,
Against Unreasonable Searches and Seizures,
Shall Not Be Violated

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Thursday, January 30, 2014

Amnesty, Border Security and Immigration are 3 separate issues - TREAT THEM THAT WAY

Ted Cruz is going nuts over his CORRECT tactical interpretation of what House republicans might do by getting BEHIND anything perceived as amnesty. It might so demoralize and disillusion the republicans that turnout is destroyed.
And no one is left insisting on border security.

Immigration

Class

Low/No Info Voters:

This argument about attitudes which Coulter (someone I normally agree with) makes little difference. It’s been going on since Andrew Jackson was elected by the semi literate, illiterate ‘low class’, ignorant westerners whose background and attitudes were UTTERLY different from those Virginia and other gentlemen who wrote the Declaration, and consummated their ideas as the USA in 1789 (in 6 pages).
The argument was made again as the Irish and Germans swarmed across our coasts in the 1840’s and 50’s and was repeated on the other coast with millions of Japanese and Chinese.
Then came the eastern and southern Europeans from about 1885 through 1924.
More recently Vietnamese and other Asians have swarmed to us.
With each wave many despaired of the values of ‘real americans’.
'They' are not like 'us'.
'They' do not share our values.
'They' will ruin America.

NEWSFLASH: There is no way back or out

We ARE and will always be an immigrant society. Hell, even the so called natives came across the Bering Sea.
With each wave, sooner or later those values we hold as making US, US have penetrated even as every single wave was said to be DIFFERENT.
If we finally FAIL to allow what we are to penetrate into the immigrants coming here the fault is OURS. It is because the Bill Ayers’, and Bernadine Dorn’s make up the syllabus nationwide. It is not because 12 million Mexicans are here illegally. It is not because all kinds of people want to be here. It is up to us to EDUCATE about our values and insist they be tested to become one of us.

Amnesty: An anathema.


We have illegals here en masse. We are not putting them on buses and boxcars and deporting them. FORGET THAT. People who dream of mass deportations ARE fringe extremists. We need some STRICT path to legal status and deportation of those who ignore that path. To hell with the Chamber of Commerce. This is too important for that. That path should one which takes equal time to reach citizenship as someone who immigrates legally. And it should be traversed with numerous checks per year.

Border Security


COMPULSORY for either immigration reform or changes of the status of illegals. The conversation begins there, and if it does not get past that, nothing else happens.
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posted by Epaminondas at permanent link#

11 Comments:

Anonymous Anonymous said...

That’s when Limbaugh proclaimed that “amnesty is the mother of all scams.” However, it’s the “fig leaf” that enables the real scam, he explained.

The fig leaf is the hollow promise that the border will be secured first, according to Limbaugh.

Friday, January 31, 2014 5:21:00 am  
Blogger Charles Martel said...

The is one issue that bothers me the most. Why will these people who chose to get here illegally have precedence over those who are patiently waiting in their countries until their number comes up? There are millions of people from all over the world, skilled professionals, PhDs who have studied and trained here and have to leave. Why not give them a path to citizenship? Is it because the 1% needs a good supply of maids and gardeners?

I don't know if deporting them is the solution, but they are certainly occupying the place of other people legally waiting for their time to see their dreams come true.

I know it's a lost cause, and cannot only be blamed on Democrats because it was Reagan the one who gave amnesty to two million illegals. It was Republicans who set the precedent.

Friday, January 31, 2014 5:39:00 am  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

I don't believe it's POSSIBLE, or advisable to deport (imagine the video), but there is NOTHING to stop us from insisting that while they are here they wait LONGER than legal immigrants for the CHANCE to take the citizenship test.

And without border security, WHY BOTHER WITH ANYTHING ELSE?

Just say we give up and make it plain. In fact we can just start tax free trade zones (currently an anathema to Obama) for Hizballah to sell hijacked cigarettes and a bank for them to xfer $ to the middle east to fund universities to teach terrorism and infiltration of america.

Friday, January 31, 2014 11:56:00 am  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

audio: Mark Levin discusses former Colorado Governor's speech on how to destry America

Mark Levin on his radio broadcast (30.1.2014) reviews the speech given by Democrat Leftist, Governor Lamm, at the 2004 Immigration-Overpopulation Conference in Washington, D.C.. Levin points out the prescient observation by Lamm, in how his fellow Leftists could destroy America if it really wanted to, by swamping it with with massive amounts of immigrants using multiculturalism as its model. The very same can be said of Europe, which has been using the multicultural model for some time now and with devastating effects.

Here is the actual speech given by Governor Lamm at the 2004 Immigration-Overpopulation Conference in Washington, D.C.: (to be continued)


Friday, January 31, 2014 11:59:00 am  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

"If you believe that America is too smug, too self-satisfied, too rich, then let's destroy America. It is not that hard to do. No nation in history has survived the ravages of time. Arnold Toynbee observed that all great civilizations rise and fall and that 'An autopsy of history would show that all great nations commit suicide.'" "Here is how they do it," Lamm said: "First, to destroy America, turn America into a bilingual or multi-lingual and bicultural country." History shows tha! t no nat ion can survive the tension, conflict, and antagonism of two or more competing languages and cultures It is a blessing for an individual to be bilingual; however, it is a curse for a society to be bilingual. The historical scholar, Seymour Lipset, put it this way: "The histories of bilingual and bi-cultural societies that do not assimilate are histories of turmoil, tension, and tragedy." Canada, Belgium, Malaysia, and Lebanon all face crises of national existence in which minorities press for autonomy, if not independence. Pakistan and Cyprus have divided. Nigeria suppressed an ethnic rebellion. France faces difficult times with Basques, Bretons, and Corsicans." Lamm went on: Second, to destroy America, "Invent 'multiculturalism' and encourage immigrants to maintain their culture. Make it an article of belief that all cultures are equal. That there are no cultural differences. Make it an article of faith that the Black and Hispanic dropout rates are due solely to prejudice and discrimination by the majority. Every other explanation is out of bounds. Third, "We could make the United States an 'Hispanic Quebec' without much effort. The key is to celebrate diversity rather than unity. As Benjamin Schwarz said in the Atlantic Monthly recently: "The apparent success of our own multiethnic and multicultural experiment might have been achieved not by tolerance but by hegemony. Without the dominance that once dictated ethnocentricity and what it meant to be an American, we are left with only tolerance and pluralism to hold us together."

(to be continued)

Friday, January 31, 2014 11:59:00 am  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Lamm said, "I would encourage all immigrants to keep their own language and culture. I would! replace the melting pot metaphor with the salad bowl metaphor. It is important to ensure that we have various cultural subgroups living in America enforcing their differences rather than as Americans, emphasizing their similarities." "Fourth, I would make our fastest growing demographic group the least educated. I would add a second underclass, unassimilated, undereducated, and antagonistic to our population. I would have this second underclass have a 50% drop out rate from high school." "My fifth point for destroying America would be to get big foundations and business to give these efforts lots of money. I would invest in ethnic identity, and I would establish the cult of 'Victimology.' I would get all minorities to think that their lack of success was the fault of the majority. I would start a grievance industry blaming all minority failure on the majority population."

(end)

Friday, January 31, 2014 12:01:00 pm  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

Anon: If our values cannot survive the open marketplace of ideas, then THAT'S HOW IT GOES.
Bitter truth.
We go down.
History is replete with this kind of crap.
The pendulum swings.
The other ideas we KNOW fail.
But people are stupid, and the temptation to let BIG GOV take care of us is an easy one to inject.
WE, HERE, have the job of making sure those who arrive have our ideals, E PLURIBUS UNUM, among them, PENETRATE and succeed.

It's OUR job to hold that baton.
It will be OUR failure.
Or OUR success.

Friday, January 31, 2014 12:03:00 pm  
Blogger Pastorius said...

Epa, I don't think the problem is the marketplace of ideas. This massive wave of illegal immigration is a conspiracy of right-wing Big Business (phony "Capitalists who want government policy to sustain their market-share and low-cost labor) and left-wing socialism. The people never had a say, or a vote in this policy. Therefore, it is a conspiracy. An open conspiracy happening right in front of our faces, but a conspiracy nonetheless.

NOT a marketplace of ideas.

Its a scam.

Friday, January 31, 2014 1:07:00 pm  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

It doesn't matter. Those who arrive here HAVE to be sold on what we are.

Sooner or later.

We DO have a vote.
Among other things, we have to make SURE IRS repressions stop so that all ideas reach everywhere.

You are, I think, talking about amnesty and voting. THAT would be a problem.
That's just ONE of the 3 issues to me.

There may be a BIG pendulum swing coming. MAY BE. People on the left can plan all they want, but perhaps we have a rubber band filling with tension.

Friday, January 31, 2014 1:34:00 pm  
Blogger Pastorius said...

I agree: Amnesy, Border Security, and Immigration are three separate issues.

My wife is an immigrant; a legal immigrant. She came here with her family. Her mother was a citizen, her father was not. My wife spent her childhood on papers. At 19, she took classes and past tests and got her citizenship. She loves America. THAT'S IMMIGRATION.

As things are, we have millions of people here, who came here because of a conspiracy between the Big Business Right and the Socialist Left. These people do not have equal access to the law. Not only that, their presence, to the extent they are tolerated and not prosecuted or deported, creates a deterioration in our system of law. To the extent that they do not have equal access to the law, THEY ARE A SERF CLASS. That is fundamentally unfair, and unConstitutional. It is unConstitutional because, as I say, they were brought here under a conspiracy of the ruling structure of our society (which is acting as our government, but is not of the people. Still, IMO, the people have to take moral responsibility for it, or we will be continuing to take advantage of a Serf Class. We can not reasonably deport millions of people, so we must give them the opportunity to be real citizens, in order to maintain our morality as a nation, and to maintain the legitimacy of our rule of law. THAT'S AMNEST.

Border Security is having a law, and a means to enforce the law, AND actually enforcing the law. If we do not enforce the law, the law becomes de-legitimized, and it's authority deteriorates to nothing.

Friday, January 31, 2014 3:30:00 pm  
Blogger Pastorius said...

I agree: Amnesy, Border Security, and Immigration are three separate issues.

My wife is an immigrant; a legal immigrant. She came here with her family. Her mother was a citizen, her father was not. My wife spent her childhood on papers. At 19, she took classes and past tests and got her citizenship. She loves America. THAT'S IMMIGRATION.

As things are, we have millions of people here, who came here because of a conspiracy between the Big Business Right and the Socialist Left. These people do not have equal access to the law. Not only that, their presence, to the extent they are tolerated and not prosecuted or deported, creates a deterioration in our system of law. To the extent that they do not have equal access to the law, THEY ARE A SERF CLASS. That is fundamentally unfair, and unConstitutional. It is unConstitutional because, as I say, they were brought here under a conspiracy of the ruling structure of our society (which is acting as our government, but is not of the people. Still, IMO, the people have to take moral responsibility for it, or we will be continuing to take advantage of a Serf Class. We can not reasonably deport millions of people, so we must give them the opportunity to be real citizens, in order to maintain our morality as a nation, and to maintain the legitimacy of our rule of law. THAT'S AMNEST.

Border Security is having a law, and a means to enforce the law, AND actually enforcing the law. If we do not enforce the law, the law becomes de-legitimized, and it's authority deteriorates to nothing.

Friday, January 31, 2014 3:30:00 pm  

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