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Whenever Any Form of Government Becomes Destructive To These Ends,
It Is The Right of the People to Alter Or To Abolish It,
And To Institute New Government

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Friday, February 12, 2016

Cruz, you REALLY screwed up, and it’s on YOU

One of the curses on modern conservatism, libertarianism and counter sharia/jihad is that it seems to be all to easy for true racists to hide among those who truly believe and camouflage themselves FOR A WHILE.

When this fails you get to a see a hopeful leader revealed as incompetent, foolish, or tolerant of the intolerance of racism and therefore 100% unacceptable.

I am not going to deal with the other side and their camouflaging centrally controlled govt coercion and social engineering behind the word LIBERAL, today

Ron Paul famously hit this wall over Stormfront’s Don Black

Trent Lott hit this wall and it ended his career.

Exceptional and SIGNIFYING was Ronald Reagan telling David Duke to STUFF his support and money

Nor is the so called Liberal side immune from this as we have seen with Mr. Jackson’s ‘Hymietown’ and the frankly racist Mr. Farrakhan

Now we have a man named Mike Bickle. From the Gospell Herald
Despite public pressure, Republican presidential candidate Ted Cruz isn’t distancing himself from the endorsement of International House of Prayer director Mike Bickle, an Evangelical pastor who characterized military dictator Adolf Hitler as “a hunter sent by God to go after Jews who don’t to convert to Christianity.” Although Jewish groups are asking Cruz campaign managers to denounce Bickle’s interpretation of scripture, a senior advisor to Cruz, Nick Muzin, welcomed Bickle’s support in a statement published Thursday (Feb. 11)  in the Jewish Journal.
Both the Anti-Defamation League and the National Jewish Democratic Council, according to a report in the Jewish Telegraphic Agency, now are demanding that Cruz clarify his position on this provocative endorsement from a religious leader whose views on Jews are perceived as highly controversial and extreme, reports Times of Israel.
There are many Evangelical Christians who identify as Christian Zionists who believe as this man does that Jews must convert. I find this HUMOROUS. WE are not converting. Inside the congregations these people and groups are looked at as allies in a common purpose, Israel’s survival, but for very different purpose, and not sharing ANY common ideals. They are seen as potentially as dangerous as any other threat out there, WHEN A RECKONING COMES. Judaism has virtually no evangelical outreach for the purpose of conversion, and it’s pursuance by others is always a touchy issue.

This is the USA and all this is fine, if momentarily discomforting. No biggy.

But let’s be clear, Bickle and groups like his pursue support of Israel because ultimately they expect when Jesus returns Jews will and must become Christians.

It’s not happening.

When this kind of thing reaches the level of a cultural ideal, it verges towards INTOLERANCE.

There are sects which teach that only though their path can salvation be reached. They are not violent, just smilingly intolerant and not willing to actually DO anything to make you conform to their thought pattern. And after all, you are going to hell. So why bother?

It’s quite another thing when this makes it’s way into presidential politics especially when the campaign doubles down.
Kansas evangelical Pastor Mike Bickle, whose endorsement the campaign publicized last month, runs a project called “Israel Mandate,” one of whose goals is “partnering with Messianic Jews for the salvation of the Jewish people.” In a sermon in 2011, Bickle said God would give Jews a chance to convert to Christianity and “raise up the hunters” against Jews who refuse. Bickle called Hitler “the most famous hunter in recent history.”
In 2005, Bickle said in a sermon that before Jesus’ coming, “a significant number of Jews will be in work camps, prison camps or death camps.” 
Nick Muzin, a senior adviser to the Texas senator’s campaign, said Bickle was referring to biblical passages.
“Our campaign welcomes support from faith leaders across the country,” Muzin said in a statement, according to Jewish Insider. “Mike Bickle is one of the hundreds who have endorsed us. My understanding is that he was paraphrasing the words of the prophets Jeremiah and Zechariah. I know that he has made support for Israel and the Jewish people a central part of his mission.”
So called, Messianic Jews accept Jesus as Messiah but follow Jewish culture. Now I am a 100% anti dogma person, but these people are not Jewish. PERIOD.

They can call themselves whatever they like. But it’s no different from me going to training workouts in a few weeks and then outside the fences in July and calling myself a New England Patriot because I follow that culture. Fine.

Unless Cruz changes in his acceptance of this support, I can’t vote for him and I will work and donate against him.

NO CHOICE. I can’t support someone who accepts support from a man who teaches I and all I love will go to work camps if I don’t follow his PERSONAL religious convictions. No different from Ron Paul and Don Black.

I did this back when Reverend Jackson demonstrated who he was, and it’s no different now.

So people are not getting my support, they are just ELIMINATING THEMSELVES.

Back to Trump. His turn to fuck it up again.

I’ll tackle Bernie and the execrable and untouchable HRC another day
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posted by Epaminondas at permanent link#

23 Comments:

Blogger Nicoenarg said...

It sounds like this asshole Bickle would think that Muzzies also are hunters sent by God to kill Jews.

WTF is wrong with these people!

Since Cruz has started campaigning to be the nominee I've seen him pull stuff that would baffle a normal human being. Guy's a snake and he'll take any support and do anything to get elected.

Nick Muzin: "My understanding is that he was paraphrasing the words of the prophets Jeremiah and Zechariah." WTF? Where in those books does it mention Hitler. Or Jews being punished for not converting to Christianity? Get your head out of your ass you moron.

Epa:

"So called, Messianic Jews accept Jesus as Messiah but follow Jewish culture. Now I am a 100% anti dogma person, but these people are not Jewish. PERIOD."

While I am not one of those Christians who think Jews should convert, the Messianic Jews I've met here are those who were born Jewish but later converted to Christianity. My understanding has been that they still remain Jewish?

Friday, February 12, 2016 11:14:00 am  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

Cruz and Trump were the only two candidates I could consider voting for in 2016 from the beginning. Neither is the perfect candidate, as witnessed in these video clips (see video description for extensive list of subjects addressed in Molyneux clips):

Truth about Ted Cruz 1:33:02 a Stefan Molyneux analysis

Trump's history rests all sides of the political fence 2:27

or

Untruth about Donald Trump1:13:20 Stefan Molyneux


Despite the unsettling positions each of these two candidates hold, the one issue which propels me to go and vote for one of these two is any candidate besides Trump or Cruz is going to load the SC with additional progressive destructive forces sure to end the greatest experiment in freedom and equality on this globe.

Friday, February 12, 2016 12:29:00 pm  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

I'm stunned that Cruz would in any way align himself with this filth.

Friday, February 12, 2016 1:27:00 pm  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

Nico -messianic jews- these folks want to accept Jesus as the Messiah, and still be Jews. I simply don't know how this is posible, since there are many importations to God to send the messiah 'REAL SOON because, as you can see God, they keep trying to kill us down here' (or thereabouts .. meaning of prayers HIGHLY interpreted by Epa), or 'Send the Messiah real soon because we need him real bad because it all humans are not just weak but terribly weak, resulting in BAD THINGS'.

So if you are Jewish and think Jesus already came and went, then ...what?

Maybe they have their own prayer books (there are plenty around in Judaism).

Anyway, if I don't think they can be Jewish, and I think almost anyone who thinks they are Jewish IS Jewish, then my guess is they are the only ones who think they are.

It's sort of ...WTF, well ok, but good luck and if you walk the razor's edge in life, it all comes out ok anyway, if there is a later.

Have to admit I am really, really disappointed with Cruz on this one, and this kind of view is, in my book, ANYTHING but conservative.

If Goldwater DESPISED Falwell, you can imagine what he thinks of this, wherever he is.

I appreciate everyone's support on this.

It's unbelievable with so many candidates, every single one has CRITICAL problems.

CRITICAL.

Friday, February 12, 2016 4:11:00 pm  
Blogger Pete Rowe said...

I am not aware that any Jew drops his/her ethnicity simply because they follow the teachings of Jesus the Messiah. One born to a Jewish mother remains Jewish whether he or she be Orthodox, Conservative, Reform, atheist, secular, or Messianic?

Why is there this thought that you can follow hinduism and remain Jewish, but woe if you follow Jesus, whose life fit the timing foretold by the prophet Daniel for the Messiah, then you all of a sudden are rendered less Jewish? I do not understand this and would like a well-thought out response.

This man chose to follow Jesus/Yeshua, but was still considered a Jew by the Nazis:

http://www.messianicassociation.org/bio-frydland.htm

Why can he not also be considered a Jew by the rest of the congregation of Jacob's children?

[Different subject] Mike Bickel and IHOP are considered to be way on the fringe by most people I know and myself included. And I am talking like some things that I consider to be demonic manifestations.

Friday, February 12, 2016 7:49:00 pm  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

Pete,
Mike Bickel and IHOP are considered to be way on the fringe by most people I know and myself included.

Then why did the Cruz campaign not distance themselves from Bickel?

Friday, February 12, 2016 7:59:00 pm  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

Check out this information about Nick Muzin:

U.S. Sen. Ted Cruz, R-Texas, today named Nick Muzin as senior advisor and deputy chief of staff for strategy, effective Monday, July 14. [2014].

[...]

Muzin, 38, is a physician and attorney, who is currently the director of coalitions for the House Republican Conference, where he oversees strategy and outreach for the 233 Republican members of the House....

Friday, February 12, 2016 8:04:00 pm  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

Canadian-born orthodox Jew?

Friday, February 12, 2016 8:06:00 pm  
Blogger Pete Rowe said...

AOW, because Cruz is a politician and Bickel's IHOP is a mega-church. Bickle's influence is rather extensive and he is featured on "Christian" TV like TBN. He reaches a lot of people; and the fact that he can remain on the fringe and still be so influential is a sad commentary on the state of the modern American Church.

As for Bickle's position, he is probably referring to Jeremiah 16. (Jeremiah being a Jewish Tanakh/OT prophet).

Jeremiah 16:

14 “Therefore behold, the days are coming,” says the Lord, “that it shall no more be said, ‘The Lord lives who brought up the children of Israel from the land of Egypt,’ 15 but, ‘The Lord lives who brought up the children of Israel from the land of the north and from all the lands where He had driven them.’ For I will bring them back into their land which I gave to their fathers.

16 “Behold, I will send for many fishermen,” says the Lord, “and they shall fish them; and afterward I will send for many hunters, and they shall hunt them from every mountain and every hill, and out of the holes of the rocks.


I cannot say that I agree with his assessment that Hitler is the hunter Jeremiah was talking about. There may be more than one time period Jeremiah was referring to.

Friday, February 12, 2016 8:08:00 pm  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

Pete, we are not talking about a jew as defined by the gestapo, we are talking about practicing judaism, and messianic jews simply do NOT practice Judaism.

The gestapo, however would haul them away with the rest because to them it's not about what you practice.

This IDIOT Bickel expects what he expects BECAUSE HE IS TOTALLY IGNORANT.

Which makes Cruz encompassing this in his run for president even more hideous, since he demonstrated over the ethanol subsidies in Iowa he is capable of rejecting items which amount to pandering.

Friday, February 12, 2016 9:24:00 pm  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

TimesofIsrael: Cruz-backer Bickle pledges commitment to Israel, Jews, explains his Hitler comments Feb 12 11:43PM
In Op-Ed on The Times of Israel, evangelical leader apologizes if he has ‘communicated beliefs poorly’

Friday, February 12, 2016 10:09:00 pm  
Blogger Pete Rowe said...

Epa,

I hear what you are saying. But, nobody questions whether the secularist and atheistic Jews retain their Jewish identity. So, why the different standard for Messianic Jews, who by and large keep the ordained feasts and observe Moses' commandments?

I think the question goes back to one that the Jewish community has wrestled with for centuries, "What makes someone a Jew?" Even being a goy myself, I have thought about the question and cannot come up with a clear answer: (a) is it cultural?; (b) is it genetic?; (c) is it religious?.

I suppose it is not my fight, but it is still a fascinating question. Thank you for listening.

Friday, February 12, 2016 10:49:00 pm  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

Pete, there is NO treatment of 'messianic jews' different from those who convert to anything else.

They all do not practice Judaism.

I have to tell you that the view from outside of what a jew is, is PROFOUNDLY different than inside.

The congregation I belong to is WIDE WIDE OPEN. Many gay people up here have been rejected and ostracized. I am not saying this is good or bad or justified or not but they are all welcome in our Temple, at all times, and in all services, and can participate to whatever level they want - conversion or not. Many HAVE converted as a result of this policy and guess what .. THEY ARE ALL JEWISH. As Jewish as I am. Maybe more, because knowing what has happened to the Jews for the last 2500 years, they volunteered.

This has NOTHING to do with the DNA of all born in families descended from the 12 tribes. As the DNA/RNA from mitochondria in the bones in the caves in Hebron have shown those of the Levi subtribe of what were high priests - Kohanim/Cohen are related.

So if you are born a Cohen you can say you are directly in line BY INHERITANCE, but inside the religion, and like former Seantor/SecDef/Congressman William Cohen, if you convert, you are not jewish.

You cannot accept Christ as the son of god and be a jew. You literally cannot say prayers which go back to and past the birth of Christ because they are incompatible with the arrival of a messiah.

I hope this shines a bit more light on this.

It makes no difference if the converted call themselves Messianic, Lutheran, Buddhist, Sikh or Zoroastrian. They are not jewish.

So by this def, Bernie, for instance is Jewish ..KINDA SORTA because he does not practice, probably does not even believe in god, but has not converted to anything else, has a Christian wife. I don't know what his child is. But because the Salafis or Shia freaks would kill him for being a 'jew', people conflate all this together and think, 'yes this is what a jew is'

Saturday, February 13, 2016 12:03:00 am  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

Anon - typical crap. Bickle has said this stuff for years, right?

Besides, my beef is with Cruz. Bickle has every right to say stupid stuff. And that belief is the heart of many evangelicals' support for Israel. I think it's dumb, but they think in the last day, I go to hell for not believing in a certain way about a supposedly perfect being who if perfect has little need for my belief.

Cruz has to answer to a different set of values.

HE wants to be president of all the people.

Saturday, February 13, 2016 12:09:00 am  
Blogger Nicoenarg said...

Damn...my simple question turned into a long debate.

Thanks for explaining what you meant Epa.

Saturday, February 13, 2016 1:32:00 am  
Blogger Pastorius said...

Epa,
You write - "So called, Messianic Jews accept Jesus as Messiah but follow Jewish culture. Now I am a 100% anti dogma person, but these people are not Jewish. PERIOD."

I ask: Was Allen Ginsberg not Jewish because he was a Buddhist?

Saturday, February 13, 2016 2:24:00 am  
Blogger Pastorius said...

On the other hand, I'm with you, Epa, on this Bickle thing.

If Cruz can't reject this piece of shit, then he needs to get out of public life.

Saturday, February 13, 2016 2:27:00 am  
Blogger Pastorius said...

Epa,
I see you explained your reason for believing that a Jew who becomes a believer that Jesus is the Messiah can not be a Jew.

The reason, apparently, is that you believe Jews must be in a state of waiting for the Messiah, or they are not Jews.
I guess I get that.

Certainly it does seem evidently true.

However, we Christians are also waiting for the world to be put right.

So once again, from my perspective, I can't see the difference.

But it really doesn't matter. I was just trying to understand.

Saturday, February 13, 2016 5:10:00 am  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

Yes, Pasto, Allan Ginsburg was NOT Jewish.

His parents may have been.
If you are Buddhist, you are Buddhist.

Same issue. If you are born in to the TRIBE (literally) you are a member of the Tribe in the eyes of those who care or try to identify things in that manner, but you are, in religion not Jewish if you practice something else.

To many in muslims lands, and the gestapo, come communists, and the KKK their interpretation was BIGOTED and RACIAL. Practiced religion was icing on that cake.

i.e. , in Syria, they'd accuse Bernie of being responsible for killing young teens to get their blood to make matzah, and Ginsburg, etc.

BTW, I'm not waiting for any messiah.
That is the ESSENCE of the idea of Tikkun Olam.
God very purposefully put it in our hands (IMHO)
Which is precisely why it looks like he helps most those who help themselves

My point is that the canoncial prayers written from time immemorial (as they replaced sacrifices) implore God to get the Messiah down here, so if you believe in Jesus, it logically cancels those prayers' purpose out.

It's all crap anyway.(IMO) all the words of men.

Epa's actual totally heretical subset of Judaism - if you walk the 'razor's edge' (Golden Rule) for the reason of knowing you are doing that (not doing it for some later REWARD), the rest takes care of itself.

TIKKUN OLAM

Of course, I'm no saint.

Saturday, February 13, 2016 10:21:00 am  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

AoW .. good find.

Just caught that.. it makes this even more incomprehensible.

Saturday, February 13, 2016 10:25:00 am  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

This has me foaming at the mouth:

Muzin oversees strategy and outreach for the 233 Republican members of the House.

Yet he sidles up to Bickle?

Saturday, February 13, 2016 10:52:00 am  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

We're missing something that has to make sense to someone.

Is this like a guy running for gov of Alabama in 1958 who loses and then sez I'll never be out-niggered again in order to get the intolerant bigots voting for him?

They think that by hugging the religious voters to them as tightly as possible no moatter what other costs are paid, this is THEIR path to the nomination?

ANd an orthodox jewish guy, a doctor and lawyer is at the heart?

Not just embarassing but sickening

My son in law has ominously pointed out that Cruz stood on stage with an endorsement from another pastor who ..well

'Recall he stood on a stage last fall with a pastor in Iowa calling for the mass execution of gays.'

What are we going to be compelled to vote for this year?

Saturday, February 13, 2016 11:31:00 am  
Blogger Always On Watch said...

They think that by hugging the religious voters to them as tightly as possible no moatter what other costs are paid, this is THEIR path to the nomination?

They're wrong.

The evangelical votes whom I know and have informed about this Bickel thing are bolting. Now.

But I am very concerned that many evangelical voters will never hear about this Bickel thing.

Saturday, February 13, 2016 11:51:00 am  

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