Did you know Muslims "invented Astronomy"? Not the Greeks. Muslims.
What an idiot this guy is.
And, this is a featured video on YouTube today.
And, just in case any of you who watch this video are inclined to believe this lunatics b.s., Muslims did not get along with the Spanish back in the golden olden days. If they did, then why did the Spanish feel the need to kick them out?
The truth is, Christians were forced to live as dhimmis (government-sanctioned second-class status). Here's a little history.
This video tells a series of lies.
Muslims did not invent Geomety. The Egyptians and the Chinese were making use of geometry thousands of years before Islam. Euclid wrote the most influential book on geometry one thousand years before Mohammed was born.
Muslims did not invent astronomy. The Chinese for instance, were doing astronomy over 1700 years before Mohammed was born.
Muslims did not invent the modern numerical system. Hindu Indians invented it, including the number 0 which Muslims so love to claim as theirs.
Now, ask yourself why Muslims lie about such things. To lie about such known facts is incredibly stupid given the fact that all one has to do is look them up in an encyclopedia.
But, that just shows you how childish and insane Islamic culture is.
This video is put out by the Muslim American Society. They are one of the most oldest and most respected Muslim organizations in America. But, they put out videos filled with outrageous lies about commonly known facts.
Interesting, huh? Keep that in mind when you hear Muslims telling you their version of the truth on any subject.
63 comments:
I'll have a taqiyya with lime, please.
They also claim they invented the game of chess, which is another lie, because this game was invented by Indians. Persians "adopted" it during their conquest of India (they were not muslims back then though)...Of course, after islam was forced on Persia, they conveniently included chess in the range of "muslim inventions"
If Musims were so clever as to be able to invent all that stuff, then why have they not come up with clever stuff since? For hundreds of years, the Islamic world has been dormant.
The truth is that Islam dumbs the mind. It also takes so much time out of anyone's day. Praying five times a day, abluting beforehand, having to think of Allah and the prophet Muhammad all the time, keeping them at the forefront of one's mind takes a lot of a Muslim's time. Far too much for him to be creative.
Then there are all the things which are forbidden him: don't say this, don't do that, don't eat the other. You know the kind of stuff. Well, anyone that has to do all that stuff can afford little time to inventing anything. After all, there are only 24 hours in a day! And most people sleep about eight of those.
To me there is little wonder that they cannot come up with inventions. To be able to invent, one has to have creative energy. Muslims have a scarcity of time, and their religion curbs creative thought. It's all quite simple, really.
Vadim and Mark,
I've just realized that Muslims have indeed invented a great many wondrous things.
Why, for instance, they invented the
ice cube (a Muslim invented that back 20,000 BC and then promptly forgot, however, the inventions was preserved in oddly detailed cave drawings)
and
the eraser (problem was, the Muslim who invented the eraser was trying to invent the condom - the eraser didn't serve well as a condom, so the Muslim went back to "praying" times a day instead)
and
this is the really strange one
Muslims actually invented
Leonardo Da Vinci
That's right. Leonardo Da Vinci was not a real human being. Instead he was a work of fiction invented by a Muslim named Hakeenan Yer-Jizya. Mr. Yer-Jizya was hard at work on the Muslim version of Dante's Inferno when, in a flight of fancy, he stumbled upon the idea for the Da Vinci character. Immediately, he understood the importance of the Da Vinci character and concentrated his efforts on drawing a detailed character outline. In so doing, Mr. Yer-Jizya actually invented everything Leonardo Da Vinci was later credited with inventing. Sadly, poor Mr. Jizya was driven mad and ended up dying in a horrific ritual bathing accident while doing his wudhu.
The detailed character outline was then picked up by Mr. Jizya's servant who later proclaimed himself to be Leonardo Da Vinci, and the whole world believed him, leading to the misconception that now dominated history.Da Vinci was a real person.
I will have to do some more digging through history. I'm sure that if we really looked, Muslims invented damned near everything. They are so fucking clever.
Pastorius, if we follow that line, we will come to conclusion that Muslims invented...Muslims...and Muslims invented the Quran...and Muslims invented pretty much everything that surrounds Muslims...
But but but...they say God did!
:O
Oh man, this is too much for my small xenophobic islamohating mind.
If it's too much for your mind, imagine the misfiring pistons and the smoke coming out of the average Muslim mind.
Seriously, can you imagine the cognitive dissonance they have to live with.
No wonder they go around fucking blowing things up.
I thought comrade Lenin did all these things
Lenin was a closet muzlim, didn't you know?
Muslims invented dialectic, but then they argued themselves into believing it didn't exist.
Pastorius,
"Muslim argued" how? They can't hold a debate. They just hack and shoot...and if they see they're losing the skirmish, they run run run.
I guess their chieftains forbade them arguing this matter again, so they abolished it.
Well, to be fair, fatwas do represent a form of theological argument. But, their form of dialectic is, "you disagree with me, I kill you."
By George, this Mo don't like the way I say Izlam! Heh!
In this fiction, the 'Zlims also claim the Taj Mahal as their creation. Bwahaha~! Wasn't the story behind the the Taj something about it being built as a dedication of love for a . . .'Zlammi(gasp)'woman'? Does that jive with anything else in 'Zlamville? Is there even one other example of outward expression of such love for a (gasp)'zlima at any time/place in 'Zlam's history?
There are far too many Hindu related markings on the Taj to believe that 'Zlamies had anything to do with its conception.
At any point in the last 6 years, or last decade or last week - can you name one positive thing the Zlami's have ever produced? Anywhere? Neither can I.
Anonymous,
I agree with you about the Taj Mahal, but I decided not to include that part to this post, because as far as I know it has not yet been proven.
:)
I doesn’t matter what the Islamic idiots claim, what does matter is that there are a multitude of politically correct mindless drones here in the West who believe and repeat these outlandish claims.
"If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it. The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie. It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State." Joseph Goebbels, Minister of propaganda, Nazi Germany
The Big Lie “ISLAM IS A RELIGION OF PEACE”
“ISLAM HAS BEEN HYJACKED BY TERRORRISTS”
READ THE KORAN!!!
oh and just to add to that
just because terrorists say they are muslims doesent mean all muslims are terrorist
oh and just for you to know
i have a phd in human resources
@ anonymous
Oh, a phd in human resources! Isn't that special!!
Next time, try getting a PhD in a real subject with content, not a phoney-baloney degree (made with pork!).
well....
if you would just read what i wrote before that instead of only commenting on the final word you would know what im talking about or did i left you speechless??
i have nothing to add after that
correction "i do"
first you dont even know the correct pronounciation of the word islam
islam is said with an s not a z
saying it with a z only makes it sound stupid(no offence ;))
islam isnt one person there are a lot of muslims in the world and just because you met one or two or even ten it doesent mean all muslims are like that for example:
if i met one american that is stupid and ignorant does it mean that all americans are like that
of course not!!!
you see what im saying.....
Anonymous said...
correction "i do"
first you dont even know the correct pronounciation of the word islam
islam is said with an s not a z
saying it with a z only makes it sound stupid(no offence ;))
islam isnt one person there are a lot of muslims in the world and just because you met one or two or even ten it doesent mean all muslims are like that for example:
if i met one american that is stupid and ignorant does it mean that all americans are like that
of course not!!!
you see what im saying.....
I reply: Ok, yes, that is true. I know some very nice, kind, caring Muslims.
However, the Krayon calls for the murder of apostates, gays and adulterers, and the Hadith propose a life for women which is, essentialy, slavery. Human beings who do not have choices are slaves. In Saudi Arabia, women are slaves.
Do you see what I mean?
well i you actually read the hadiths you will know what they mean instead of just assuming their content.
and hadiths are quotes of the prophet of islam (pbuh) and you know.... when his wife died he didnt speak or go out of his home for weeks because of how much he loved her would a man who loved his wife so much would tell the people to beslave their wifes think about it. there is no hadith that says to do so except forged hadiths.
i am a muslim and no the hadith does not say so because i know that because i am a muslim.
and as in the case of saudia arabia
"In Saudi Arabia, women are slaves"
no sorry they are not slaves they choose what they want to do or be.
in sudia arabia there are entire malls made for women so that they can enjoy shopping and other things freely and they also have whole universities only for women to study what they want and even more many saudi women have drivers to take then anywhere they want there is a lot of choice for them this is not slavery the problem is that many of you people have never went to saudia arabia and just assume that the conditions are like that they are not. and if it is about men hitting their wives islam doesent incourage this and it is a global problem not only in the arab world.
please people know about something dont just assume....
i am a muslim and i live very close to saudia arabia in bahrain and i always went to saudia arabia for shopping and never seen what you are about because it is mainly based on ignorance (forgive me;))
Anonymous,
You said: hadiths are quotes of the prophet of islam
I say: To be precise, they are quotes and stories, not just quotes.
You said: "In Saudi Arabia, women are slaves"
no sorry they are not slaves they choose what they want to do or be.
I say: That is not true. The truth is, in Saudi Arabia the law is structured such that women can not drive, are compelled to marry the man their parents choose for them, can not decided for themselves whether or not to be educated, can not decide for themselves whether to go outdoors or when to go out doors, or with whom to associate when they are out of doors.
That is a life in which women are not allowed to make their own decisions.
That is, essentially, slavery.
Don't lie.
You said: in sudia arabia there are entire malls made for women ...
I say: Thanks for admitting it. They do not have the freedom to choose with whom they will associate. They are not allowed to associate with men. Men make up the power structure, and women are not allowed to associate with anyone in the power structure. Therefore, women can not gain power.
You have proven my point.
You said: they also have whole universities only for women to study ...
I say: Yes, IF their man will allow them to go to school.
You said: even more many saudi women have drivers to take then anywhere they want
I say: Once again, thanks for admitting it, and you have proven my point. Wealthy Saudi women, whose husbands allow them afford them some sutonomy, have drivers "to take them anywhere they want..." Poor Saudi women do not have any such thing. Additionally, once again, this is totally under the control of the man who is the owner of the woman, whether it be her husband, father, or brother.
Once again, stop lying.
You said: i am a muslim and i live very close to saudia arabia in bahrain and i always went to saudia arabia for shopping and never seen what you are about because it is mainly based on ignorance (forgive me;))
I say; Well, you seem like a nice guy, but I think you are lying to yourself. But, then again, if you came to America, you'd probably, a la Sayid Qutb, think we live an absolutely decadent life, and you would probably be disgusted, and in some ways, you'd be right to be disgusted by our decadence.
But, here's the thing people like you have a hard time understanding:
Freedom of Choice means having the ability to choose whether or not to be a good person. Decadence is the exhaust of a free society.
You can not enforce true goodness. Goodness which is enforced (coerced) is not true goodnes. It is, instead, the goodness of an automaton, like a robot.
Freedom of Choice is a requirement for the manifestation of true Goodness.
You ought to try it sometime.
well im not lying in anything
and i dont "think" i know better
i KNOW i know better than you because i live here im not lying to myself you wont understand anything about islam because you are not a muslim i am and i know more about my religion.
most of the information you said is wrong dont pretend to know about something you know nothing about but insist that you are right.
i try and try you all are so close minded and think you know every thing like that you dont know anything about mislims and islam.
Ok, then let's break it down piece by piece:
Is it illegal for women to drive in Saudi Arabia? Yes, or no?
yes it is....
but just because they cant drive doesent mean they are slaves and have no rights.
Ok, so let's go with your answer for now. They aren't slaves, but it is against the law for them to drive.
So, the next question is, can women decide for themselves whether they will go to college? Or does their father/brother/husband decide this for them? And, what happens if they violate the wishes of their male guardian?
Here's another question for you, real quick:
What is the Arabic word for slave?
stupid
no thats you not the word :)
any way
slave in arabic has one word but two meanings
one abd which is a slave
and another abd which means worshipper not slave idiot!
again no offence ;D
and your other question...
in islam saudia arabia mostly but not all saudi people some them say that when a women travels she needs a male mohram (consort) when she travels.
and yes a women needs her father`s consent but only if she`s under 18 but also guys do cuz if theyre under age they need an adult consent and also education is forced by law so when they go to college they get to choose :p
Ok, thanks. So, what about answering the other questions about whether women can make their own decision about going to college, and what happens if they choose to go against the wishes of their male guardian?
well she can go to court against him and they will of course rule in her side because education is more important :)
of course she can make her own decision and her family will support her because they are not ignorant and want the best for their daughter and even if her male guardian doesent allow her she can go to court and of course rule in her favor cuz education is more important.
happy :) ???
Anonymous,
I don't believe you.
However, we have a blogger here who lived in Saudi Arabia, and now lives in Pakistan. Maybe he can help us out here.
I'll email him and ask him to join the discussion.
Ok, my friend, I am all but 100% sure you are lying, and you will be confronted with the truth within the next few days.
You are entitled to your own opinions, but you are NOT entitled to your own facts.
anyway i dont care about saudia arabia or their rules
all i know is bahrain the pearl of the arabian gulf <3 <3 :D
my home country and my favourite place in the world is much more open and freeier why dont you look it up ;D
see ya!!
Yes, as I understand it, Bahrain is freer than Saudi Arabia.
yeah it is thats why its the best place to visit in the gulf ;)
Well, it looks like my friend is not going to show up, so I'm going to have to start digging out info myself.
Read this debate for instance. The overall point is that, while Saudi Arabia is modernizing gradually, it is the most backward in terms of its totalitarian adherence to its own Wahabbist interpretation of strict Sharia.
And, when Saudi women do go to University, they go to a women-only university:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/education/2008/nov/01/saudi-arabia-middle-east
Hey Pastorius,
Sorry man, I was away for work. Anyway, I am here now. Its 12.20 AM in the morning here in Dubai. I am going to try and go over what's been said here and try to pick it up from there.
Anonymous,
"first you dont even know the correct pronounciation of the word islam. islam is said with an s not a z; saying it with a z only makes it sound stupid(no offence ;))"
Just because someone says Izlam instead of Islam doesn't mean they don't know what you're talking about. For example, judging by the way you write English, I'd say you don't know what you're talking about because you miss even the most basic things like '.' or ','. I had to add it in your quote! So grow up, if that's even at all possible.
"when his wife died he didnt speak or go out of his home for weeks because of how much he loved her"
Oh he was so in love with Khadijah that after she died, he went off and married 10 other women. Man, I have never seen that kind of love ever! Look, if you expect us to quote hadith numbers and sura and ayah numbers, you gotta do the same. Just because you pulled something out of your butt doesn't mean its true. So vague references to ahadith like that don't mean crap here.
"i am a muslim and no the hadith does not say so because i know that because i am a muslim." AND "well im not lying in anything
and i dont "think" i know better
"i KNOW i know better than you because i live here im not lying to myself you wont understand anything about islam because you are not a muslim i am and i know more about my religion."
You're so full of yourself. NO, you don't know better because you're a Muslim, in fact, you don't even know what Pastorius knows or not about Islam. You are basing your assumption on the premise that since you're Muslim you must know better about Islam. Do you read what you write? And alongwith all this childish bull crap, you have the audacity to proclaim, "i have a phd in human resources"? Get a life!
""In Saudi Arabia, women are slaves"
no sorry they are not slaves they choose what they want to do or be."
And then you add later,
"anyway i dont care about saudia arabia or their rules"
Yeah you're showing me how mature you are.
Now, having lived in Saudi Arabia I actually agree with Pastorius, you are a liar. Apart from hurling insults, there isn't anything else that you have added here so far.
It might be surprising to you, but no we can't just take your word for it just because you say so. Unlike Saudi Arabia and Bahrain (where they have just started closing bars at hotels that are less than 3 stars), people in the west actually look at facts. Its not a tradition in the west to believe in people just because they tell everyone to believe in them.
"
"and your other question...
in islam saudia arabia mostly but not all saudi people some them say that when a women travels she needs a male mohram (consort) when she travels.
and yes a women needs her father`s consent but only if she`s under 18 but also guys do cuz if theyre under age they need an adult consent and also education is forced by law so when they go to college they get to choose :p"
So, lying is a habit that you have or your hobby? Who are you trying to kid here? "some people say women need a male mohram"? Are you flipping out of your mind? Have you never been to Saudi Arabia? Its not that SOME say, its the law there. Women, when they go out have to either be in a group of at least 3 women or with either their husband, father or brother/s. And the Mutawwas are always there lurking around in their "Suburbans" (yeah, they hate Americans so much they can't even live without their cars, pathetic bastards) to make sure men and women don't mingle if they're not 1 of the above!
As for your comment that women are not slaves and they are free to choose whatever they want. Really now? Some women, a while back, officially protested against the driving ban, and they got bunch of lashes in return. Freedom of choice MY BUTT!
"of course she can make her own decision and her family will support her because they are not ignorant and want the best for their daughter and even if her male guardian doesent allow her she can go to court and of course rule in her favor cuz education is more important."
Again, can you stop pulling crap out of nowhere? What in the world are you talking about. You sound like Yusuf Abd-allah. He translated the Qur'an for a western audience and twisted the meaning of words so many times that the original meaning was lost. You talk like, "Oh yeah, this is what they want to hear, this is what I will say." and to finish it off, you add "happy?". You're not talking to people that think questioning is wrong. You're talking here with people that will question every dumb thing that comes out of your mouth (or your keyboard). So try and grow up and maybe we can have a debate or even an argument if that's what you're looking for.
And to finish all of what I am saying off FOR NOW, I will tell you the same thing that you said to Pastorius, but in your case, it rings true of who you are and what you need to do:
"stupid
no thats you not the word
OMG!!!!
what the ****
go see a doctor ur sick man
ur sick go see a shrink you need sessions
10 a day will do you good
i mean how sick are you youre just disgusting absolutely disgusting"
I just had to retype all of what you said and say it back to you just for you to see how mature you are.
Happy commenting!
Oh I had to come back because I forgot to mention something else that came up in this comment thread.
A lof of moronic Muslims that think the whole world is moronic always like to say, "Saudis are following Wahhabism from the 18th century, so its not real Islam". Well, talk to a "wahhabi" and call him that, he will correct you write away and say he is more properly known as "salafi" not a "wahhabi". In fact, "wahhabi" is a derogatory term. What's a "salafi"? That's the term used for the first 3 generations of Islam including that of Mohammed's (or Muhammad's, since Anonymous's little mind is so concerned with the spelling). So what "wahhabism" actually is, is "salafism" which means they're trying to follow the Islam followed by Mohammed and his companions. I can actually make the connection all the way back also if you are interested, but judging by the way anonymous debates, I don't know if he can take that at all. He might just hurl insults after I mention facts and then try to tell me that I gotta bow down to him because he has a PHD in Human resources ;-)
that should have read "correct you Right away"...
As I promised that I would write here briefly about the connection between Wahabbism and Salafism!
Here it goes:
Sheik Muhammad ibn Abd al Wahhab (1703–1792) who worked toward "reviving" the movement of "Salafism" was inspired by the work of Ibn Taymiya (1263 - 1328) who was a member of the Hanbali school of "fiqh" founded by Imam Ahmed ibn Hanbal (780 - 855) who was taught on fiqh by Imam al-Shafi (767 - 820), the founder of the school named after him. Imam al-Shafi was a disciple of Malik ibn Anas (715 - 796) who started the Maliki school of fiqh--he also compiled a collection of Hadith known as Al-Muwatta.
Now, of course I can present a more detailed paper on this but this should suffice for now.
well...
i dont a f**k
im not a wahabi or a f***in salafi
these are extremeist groups or sectors which give islam a bad name okee
"well...
i dont a f**k
im not a wahabi or a f***in salafi
these are extremeist groups or sectors which give islam a bad name okee"
Anonymous, you gotta get off your high horses because no one gives a crap whether you give a "f**k" or not. Just because you can hurl cussing out doesn't mean we're going to listen to you.
Just because of the fact that you separated wahabis and salafis as though they were two different groups shows that you don't know what you're talking about.
Mohammed himself is considered a Salafi, so in your words, Mohammed gives Islam a bad name. Take out Mohammed from your perverted religion then we might have some respect for you but until then, you can't fool anyone with "oh they have hijacked Islam" type lingo. Because most people here on this blog know about Islam.
Whether you consider Salafis extremists or not is your business and frankly, I don't give a damn about what you think personally. However, Salafis have it right about Islam and you don't. You can pick and choose between what you want to follow and what not, Salafis follow the whole Islam.
Again, before you were defending Saudi Arabia and now you don't give a "f**k"? If you're arguing here for the sake of argument, I'd say you're just wasting your time, and trying to get attention because soon we're all going to lose interest in your dumbness.
owwww look who`s talkin about religions.
at least im not stupid enough to think that god would send his own sun to die on earth while he created all of the universe its stupid enough thinking that god has a son.
god gave you a chance when he brought down the "prophet" jesus to earth but all you did in the centuries that came before is change the writings and verses in the bible, thats why god brought upon arabs islam. and about something else, since u say that jesus is god`s son why do you worship him and not the god that created him or his so called "father" instead of his son could you answer that questions.
you are all just disgusting racists at least my religion orders me to respect other religions and faiths unlike yours.
oh and please dont make up your own conclusions about my prophet he was not a salafi he was a muslim and adding to your stupidity salafism did not exist in the time of the prophet(pbuh) you dont know anything and also muhammed didnt belong to any sect of islam because these came after him. stupid...
Anonymous,
First off--LOL!
Now,
"you are all just disgusting racists at least my religion orders me to respect other religions and faiths unlike yours."
Um, point out where anyone mentioned anything about RACE here. Again, calling people names here is not going to get you anywhere--it only reveals how ignorant and pissed off you are.
As for what you said about Christianity, I am not going to go there because we're talking about Islam not Christianity. Changing the subject might be the way you and your type go about it among your circles but not here.
And you said your religion teaches you to respect other religions--really now? Is that why you said the following:
"at least im not stupid enough to think that god would send his own sun to die on earth while he created all of the universe its stupid enough thinking that god has a son."
Anyway, I can see that all you can muster up is crap. Your knowledge of not only Christianity but even Islam is pretty laughable. And on top of all that you seem not educated enough to be able to actually read what I wrote. Because notice, I didn't say Mohammed was a Salafi but that he is "considered" a Salafi. And also, Salafi is a term used for "the first 3 generations of Muslims" which includes your demented Prophet Mohammed. I will repeat this again in the simplest and clearest form that I can for your little mind, Salafism is not a sect. It is another term for "pure" Islam, which means, the Islam that was followed by Mohammed and his companions.
You of course have proven beyond the shadow of a doubt that you have no idea what all of this means. All you have done is resorted to insults which, to be quite honest, I ignore right away anyway because I don't want to and won't stoop down to your level. Now, what you are doing reminds me of when Mohammed met with Christians from Najran. He said, "let us curse each other and whoever's curse comes true, the other one converts to their religion". That's a paraphrased account of the story from Sura Al Maryam. You follow your murderous and power crazy prophet's example, I should commend you on that because that makes you a good Muslim--too bad it keeps you far away from becoming a good human being.
Now let's see if you can come up with something intelligent or not. I must say, I am not holding my breath.
Avenging Apostate,
Thank you for stepping in here.
Obviously, you know more of the specifics than I do.
This Anonymous character is not being truthful, in my estimation, and I have a feeling he knows it.
The reason God sent His Son to die for our sins is because God Created a world with human beings who are made in His own Image.
This means we have Free Will, Creativity, and Reason.
When we "fell", sinned, turned away from God's way, He could have done one of three things,
1) He could have wiped out the whole planet, all human beings
2) He could have turned us into automatons, like robots, who no longer had our Free Will,
or
3) He could have done what He did, which is to offer a Blood Sacrifice so that we could continue to be Free, and yet still have a relationship with Him.
The way I see it, God died for our Free Will, as much as He died to Save us from the destruction which our "sins" cause us.
You told me the word "abd",
"in arabic has one word but two meanings - one abd which is a slave - and another abd which means worshipper not slave"
In Christianity, God is Willing to die for our Freedom. In Islam, Allah demands slavery.
That is really the ultimate message here.
And, for that, you call us "racists".
By the way, the word "abd" is also an Arabic pejorative for "Black person."
Talk about racist.
umm idiots..? do you still watch this crap? :P im back ^_^!!
Andd btw... Im only 16, i dont even have a highschool diploma! XD not to mention a PHD :P just argued you to prove how asshole-ish u ppl are =] i dont really care about religion that much actually, this a quote from the Quran: "lakom dinokom o liya denee" this means that *drumroll* u have your religion and i have mine tadaa!! :D
therefore ;P all u said about islam is crap -.- all i know is that verse and that i pray, i fast, and i follow the hadith and the sunnah and what my fathers and forefathers followed BELEIVING that it is the right thing to belive in which im sure ;] since early days of islam muslims respected christians and other religions so im gonna do the same.
P.S. i dont think there's an arbic/islamic site offending christians in any way, unlike this 1 < obvious hint. now this is racism ^.^
TC i hope i taught u something ;P bbye xmx
Anonymous,
Is Islam a race?
Oh, and by the way, that's not a verse from the Krayon.
lol? 0.o
sorry mr.smart ass but IT! IS! FROM! THE QURAN! it's the sixth verse of surat Al-Kafirun
And no, Islam isn't a race, it's a religion that connects all races and kinds through their shared beleif in God and the ways of islam (praying, fasting etc...) i.e. any person of any religion can join islam and it's not limited to a single race, it's not a race itself. See? not so different from christian teachings =]
Umm sorry about the racism thing ;P, i dont really know the word for religion haters so i just called it racism, sorry again. This is refered to as Islam-phobia i guess, u people are Islam-phobic
Thanks for providing the verse. You're correct. It is in the Krayon.
Yes, you're right. I'm an
Islamophobe, and with good reason.
The book you quoted al-Kafiroon (the Unbelievers) is a Meccan verse.
The Medinan verses (written later) abrogate the Meccan verses.
Among the Medinan verses are:
[8.39] Shakir: ...fight with them until there is no more persecution and religion should be only for Allah... [8.40] Yusuf Ali: If they [unbelievers] refuse [to stop fighting], be sure that God is your Protector...[8.41] Shakir: ...whatever thing [loot] you gain, a fifth of it is for Allah and for the Apostle...the day on which the two parties met [in a Jihad versus anti-Jihad battle]...[8.42]...Allah might bring about a matter which was to be done, that he who would perish might perish by clear proof [bring success to Muslims engaged in robbing a caravan near Badr against all the odds]...[8.43]...Allah showed them [the Mekkans] to you in your dream as few [fighters]; and if He had shown them [the Mekkans] to you as many [fighters] you would certainly have become weak-hearted [i.e., hearts. See the similar discussion in K 002:249 about how a smaller army can defeat a larger army]...[8.44]...when you met, as few [fighters] in your eyes and He made you to appear little [few fighters] in their eyes, in order that Allah might bring about a matter which was to be done [a Jihad versus anti-Jihad battle brought on by overconfidence in each side]...[8.45]...when you meet a party [in battle], then be firm...[8.46]...obey Allah and His Apostle and do not quarrel for then you will be weak in hearts [demoralized] and your power [to execute Jihad] will depart...[8.47]...be not like those [Mekkans] who came forth from their homes [in an anti-Jihad War on Islamic terrorism]...[8.48]...when the two parties [Muslims versus Mekkans] came in sight of each other he [Satan] turned upon his heels...
..slay the idolaters wherever you find them...take them captives and besiege them and lie in wait for them in every ambush...
Excerpt K 9:005
Set 33, Count 91
Excerpt K 9:029
Set 38, Count 101
Fight those who do not believe in Allah...nor follow the religion of truth, out of those who have been given the Book, until they pay the tax in acknowledgment of superiority and they are in a state of subjection.
If you want me to provide more, I will.
The larger point you are missing, in my opinion, is that while there are peaceful verses in the Quran, and while you may follow them as the inspiration of your own individual life (and thank God for that), that does not mean that Islam is a religion of peace. Instead, because the Medinan verses abrogate, or supersede the Meccan verses, the truth is, Islam is violent in it's essence.
That is why the scholars at al-Azhar teach violence. That's why the Imams teach violence. That's why even a moderate Muslim will often tell you that gays and apostates should be stoned to death. That's why Theo Van Gogh was murdered. That's why Salman Rushdie was hounded to the ends of the Earth, and even the peaceful Yusuf Islam (Cat Stevens) called for his death.
hellow again,
owkayyy... so here's the deal, i tottaly agree with what you wrote and quoted, BUT! what you quoted was from the parts of the Quran that called for Jihad at the times of Islamic expansions and conquers in the 7th century AD/CE, and for times of war. And although they seem to contradict with the meccan verses they work togeather with them to reach an equilibrium or middle point, i.e. not to live in a constant state of war, and not to live in total numb peace, it's important to note here that at the time of the prophet (when quran was still being brought by god to muhammad (PBUH)) muslims were busy with their expansions and the ayat/verses that you mentioned were only to the non-muslims that were opposed to the muslims, not everybody. in other words, these verses were to those who wanted to make the muslims fail or opposed them, and these verses act as instructions on how to deal with them.
And about the two guys you mentioned, i dont agree with how they were treated =/!! i mean although what i think they did was offensive i dont think they should have been STONED to death because of it, in my opinion these are examples of misunderstandings of Quranic verses in the case of salman rushdie and also, examples of extremism in the practice of islam which i am against of course.
sorry if what i said seems hazy, just ask if anything else i didnt explain =].
TC xmx
Anonymous,
Ok.
By the way, the reason I said, at first, that that verse you quoted was not from the Koran is because it sounded like modern words. But, I see that you were giving a modern colloquial interpretation (and, an accurate one at that) to a real verse in the Koran. That fine.
As for what you say, let me pose this question; I oppose Islam, in that I oppose the stoning of apostates, gays and adulterers, and I oppose the second-class citizenhood of Infidels and of women. To the extent that that version of Sharia is the version of Islam which anyone wants to expand, I absolutely oppose the expansion of Islam.
Because there are very few Muslims who will stand against the above interpretation of Sharia, when authorities are telling them it is the correct interpretation of Sharia, I have come to believe that ANY expansion of Islam, including more citizenship for people of Islamic faith, is very dangerous to the Western world.
If there were a large contingent of moderate Muslims, like yourself, who were willing to stand against the Islamic authorities in their strict interpretation of Sharia, then I would feel much more at ease with the Muslim community.
lol good ^_^!!
I know what you mean, like if u ask a really really religious person (here in bahrain i mean, from my experience)about the treatment of women, he wouldnt count them as second class citizens or below men, he might even back up this with verses from the Quran, i mean it all depends on the interpretation of the religion itself and the Quran, i mean when comparing two interpretations/prospectives of islam, they might sound like two different religions, from here comes sunnah and shia diffrentiation, wahhabism, extremists, sufis and other types of islam, the same with christianity i suppose, depending on the interpretation different groups come up(not sure about the christianity part, correct me if im wrong)
From here comes terrorism, groups use islam and interpret it in
>!WRONG!< ways to justify their WRONG doings, i personally HATE terrorists for doing so, they used my religion and interpreted it like they want and now the whole world coins a wrong stereotype of islam and a wrong idea about muslims because of this. i mean if ur gonna be a terrorist and fight for a cause u might as well make up ur own religion rather than ruining one in the eyes of the whole world. B
y doing so, they lost their cause of defending islam and just turned everyone against it! (sorry if im taking this too personally btw :p)
i could explain about the stonning of apostates and others but it'll take forever, i can explain if you want.
i didnt really get your point in the second paragraph, further explaining will be aprreciated. tnx =]
Anonymous,
You said:
i didnt really get your point in the second paragraph, further explaining will be aprreciated.
I say; Yeah, you're right, my second paragraph doesn't make a whole lot of sense. Sorry.
Here's what I said:
-----As for what you say, let me pose this question; I oppose Islam, in that I oppose the stoning of apostates, gays and adulterers, and I oppose the second-class citizenhood of Infidels and of women. To the extent that that version of Sharia is the version of Islam which anyone wants to expand, I absolutely oppose the expansion of Islam.-----
Here's what I meant to say:
I oppose the strict interpretation of Sharia. And, being that it is the dominant form of Islam, since moderate Muslims will not stand strong against it, what do you think people like me should do? I oppose anything that promotes the expansion of Islam, because Islam has proven itself to be untrustworthy, as it will not jettison the strict interpretation of Sharia.
You know, we in the West had to go through terrible wars to get rid of the divine right of Kings, of lack of separation of church and state, to get one person one vote to be the rule, and to gain our freedom of speech.
Are Muslims willing to fight and die for these things?
I think the answer is a resounding, No.
hey =)
sorry been away since forever, its summer ^^ took a brake from everything..
love ur qn btw, strong argument.
Well, in contrast islam is against the seperation of religion from state, as in the sharia should be part of the legal system in an islamic state. Also, the original form of chosing a ruler for an islamic state is by election, as in the case of Abu-Bakr, Omar, Uthman, and Ali.. after this most forms of leadership became hereditary which in my opinion in not really islamic and follows the interests of the ruling families and their followers, this also happens in modern days in most arab states(KSA, Kuwait, Bahrain, Qatar, UAE, Oman) not that i find these rulers corrupt, on the contrary.
I dont really think that the strict interpretation is the only dominant form of Islam, i mean look at other islamic countries not only arab states, most practice a moderate form (more like the original form) of islam.
To get to the point, islam encourages the union of state and religion and also, islam does not aknowledge the divine right of kings (does not exist in islam) and also, the voting system for a ruler is supposed to be the one followed, therefore i think islam proved itself most worthy in this field, in that a ruler is not chosen if he is not worthy of rule. hope i was clear here and i'l be glad to answer any other points u have. TC
No, I don't really have any other questions.
It seems to me you are clear.
You oppose separation of Church and State, and you are pro-Sharia.
And, you believe many Muslim nations practice a moderate form of Islam.
Thanks for being honest.
Once you say those three things, it is really left to everyone to say, Hey, I agree, or, No way, I don't agree.
I don't agree with you.
That's that.
In the first comment of the Anonymous muslim he says:
"a muslim scientist in the golden islamic ages long ago with the last name of al-jaber invented algebra and you cant say anything about it".
That is abig stupid lie. Algebra cann't be 'invented', is a branch of Mathematics that exists since millenia before CE And the word algebra doesn't come from a personal name but from the name of the book "The Compendious Book on Calculation by Completion and Balancing" which in arabic is "Al-Kitāb al-mukhtaṣar fī ḥisāb al-jabr wa-l-muqābala". The book was written by Muhammad ibn Mūsā al-Khwārizmī, a Persian who despite his name, it seems was Zoroastrian, not muslim, because this is how is mentioned by historian al-tabari. You can find all this information on internet, Wikipedia is a good place.
So much for the 'educated' muslim called Anonymous who posted these lies.
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