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Whenever Any Form of Government Becomes Destructive To These Ends,
It Is The Right of the People to Alter Or To Abolish It,
And To Institute New Government

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Thursday, July 21, 2016

UPDATED - Donald Trump Draws Moral Equivalence Between Erdogan Purge and United States Vis a Vis Civil Liberties


ASININE STATEMENT FROM TRUMP.

He sounds like fucking Noam Chomsky.

What a fuckin' idiot.

From the NYT:
Mr. Trump’s discussion of the crisis in Turkey was telling, because it unfolded at a moment in which he could plainly imagine himself in the White House, handling an uprising that could threaten a crucial ally in the Middle East. The United States has a major air base at Incirlik in Turkey, where it carries out attacks on the Islamic State and keeps a force of drones and about 50 nuclear weapons. 
Mr. Trump had nothing but praise for President Recep Tayyip Erdogan, the country’s increasingly authoritarian but democratically elected leader. “I give great credit to him for being able to turn that around,” Mr. Trump said of the coup attempt on Friday night. “Some people say that it was staged, you know that,” he said. “I don’t think so.” 
Asked if Mr. Erdogan was exploiting the coup attempt to purge his political enemies, Mr. Trump did not call for the Turkish leader to observe the rule of law, or Western standards of justice. “When the world sees how bad the United States is and we start talking about civil liberties, I don’t think we are a very good messenger,” he said.
GO READ THE WHOLE THING.

UPDATE -

NICO POINTS OUT THAT I SHOULD NOT HAVE TRUSTED THE NEW YORK TIMES TO GIVE THE FULL CONTEXT:

It's always good to read the whole transcript, rather than the careful editing of NYT to makeTrump sound bad at any cost.
"I think right now when it comes to civil liberties, our country has a lot of problems, and I think it’s very hard for us to get involved in other countries when we don’t know what we are doing and we can’t see straight in our own country. We have tremendous problems when you have policemen being shot in the streets, when you have riots, when you have Ferguson. When you have Baltimore. When you have all of the things that are happening in this country — we have other problems, and I think we have to focus on those problems. When the world looks at how bad the United States is, and then we go and talk about civil liberties, I don’t think we’re a very good messenger. 
I don’t know that we have a right to lecture. Just look about what’s happening with our country. How are we going to lecture when people are shooting our policemen in cold blood. How are we going to lecture when you see the riots and the horror going on in our own country. We have so many difficulties in our country right now that I don’t think we should be, and there may be a time when we can get much more aggressive on that subject, and it will be a wonderful thing to be more aggressive. We’re not in a position to be more aggressive. We have to fix our own mess."
That is not different from anything he's said throughout his campaign. NYT tried to spin this, Trump isn't saying anything different.

FROM PASTORIUS - Still, I have to say, I don't give a fuck how the world sees us as a result of a bunch of bad people who formed an organization called Black Lives Matter.  They are the culprits, not the US government, or the US as a nation. They are criminals and they are being stoked by the same kinds of Islamists that Erdogan, himself, is aligned with an represents.

Erdogan is a bad guy.

Black Lives Matter is bad.

The US is not bad.
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posted by Pastorius at permanent link#

7 Comments:

Blogger WC said...

Pasto - to quote Newt once again "Trump is not a conservative but he is an alley to conservatives."
I wonder if he's angling to be an ally to liberals to get their vote?

Thursday, July 21, 2016 5:00:00 pm  
Blogger Nicoenarg said...

It's always good to read the whole transcript, rather than the careful editing of NYT to makeTrump sound bad at any cost.

"I think right now when it comes to civil liberties, our country has a lot of problems, and I think it’s very hard for us to get involved in other countries when we don’t know what we are doing and we can’t see straight in our own country. We have tremendous problems when you have policemen being shot in the streets, when you have riots, when you have Ferguson. When you have Baltimore. When you have all of the things that are happening in this country — we have other problems, and I think we have to focus on those problems. When the world looks at how bad the United States is, and then we go and talk about civil liberties, I don’t think we’re a very good messenger.

I don’t know that we have a right to lecture. Just look about what’s happening with our country. How are we going to lecture when people are shooting our policemen in cold blood. How are we going to lecture when you see the riots and the horror going on in our own country. We have so many difficulties in our country right now that I don’t think we should be, and there may be a time when we can get much more aggressive on that subject, and it will be a wonderful thing to be more aggressive. We’re not in a position to be more aggressive. We have to fix our own mess."

That is not different from anything he's said throughout his campaign. NYT tried to spin this, Trump isn't saying anything different.

Thursday, July 21, 2016 5:23:00 pm  
Blogger Nicoenarg said...

I agree the US as a nation is not a culprit. The current Obama admin does get the blame for a lot of the rhetoric that the BLM terrorists have taken and run with. Can't agree that the US government is not responsible for the civil unrest.

Thursday, July 21, 2016 6:55:00 pm  
Blogger Pastorius said...

Ok, I see what you mean. You're right about that.

And in that sense, the people are responsible, as they elected Obama TWICE.

Thursday, July 21, 2016 7:55:00 pm  
Blogger Epaminondas said...

Can't believe we are flipped around on this one Pasto ... John Quincy Adams ALWAYS MAINTAINED that the best way for the USA to behave in the world was a model for behavior and that until, at the least, slavery was solved we had no business doing anything but trying to be an example.

The USA, (google the 'Watching America' site) from outside is a society in which the redneck cops are picking out blacks and a nascent civil war may be brewing because we STILL can't solve problems which began in the 1600's imported from Africa.

Trump is actually on that path. I may not agree (we should be speaking out and kicking Turkey from NATO), but that govt has been elected, what FOUR TIMES in free elections since 2000?

Are we going to tell a nation which has had as many national elections as we have had how to govern itself?

Who are we to do that?

That is STEP ONE of American Exceptionalism. We publicize, and deconstruct ourselves and find a solution, without reference to outside at all, and use THAT as an example to others.. They can do as they see fit in, ESPECIALLY, their own FREE SOCIETIES, but they must deal with the bill.

We provide an example IF WE CAN. Nothing more, especially when it's about a nation freely electing it's own demise (WHICH CAN BE ARGUED IS WHAT WE ARE ABOUT TO DO WITH HRC)

'We’re not in a position to be more aggressive. We have to fix our own mess.'

America First.

Friday, July 22, 2016 10:44:00 am  
Blogger Pastorius said...

I get your points. Very well taken. I did not take into account Turkey's record on Democratic elections. That is important.

Here's the thing: Erdogan has had 50,000 people (from all walks of life) removed from their jobs and many of them locked up, in the days since the coup.

It's as if he had a list ALREADY.

It's not as if.

He had a fuckin' list.

That is the work of a dictator, not a Democratically elected President.

I'm not saying he wasn't Democratically elected.

I'm saying he is behaving like a Dictator.

Friday, July 22, 2016 1:23:00 pm  
Blogger Nicoenarg said...

Damn...something related to Trump and I actually agree with Epa?!!! I feel like this is one of those walk across the aisle and shake hands kinda moment with epic music playing.

Friday, July 22, 2016 10:06:00 pm  

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