Monday, August 11, 2008

RUSSIA'S INVASION OF GEORGIA IS LIKE SADDAM'S INVASION OF KUWAIT

- and it should be met with the same response.

RUSSIA PUSHED PASSED THE "DISPUTED" REGION OF SOUTH OSSETIA AND IS NOW ATTACKING AND INVADING GEORGIA PROPER.

(MORE HERE.)

LIKE SADDAM'S INVASION OF KUWAIT, THIS AGGRESSION MUST NOT BE ALLOWED TO STAND.

RUSSIA MUST BE SEVERELY SANCTIONED AT THE UNSC (FORCING THEM TO VETO IT!), AND THEN IMMEDIATELY THREATENED WITH MILITARY RETALIATION - BY THE USA AND NATO.

WE SHOULD:


QUARANTINE THEIR NAVY AND
CANCEL ALL INTERNATIONAL AIR TRAFFIC AND
FREEZE ALL THEIR ASSETS.
IF WE DON'T THEN THIS WILL BE JUST THE START AND RUSSIA WILL INVADE UKRAINE NEXT FOLLOWED BY THE REST OF EASTERN EUROPE.
A DIRECT WAR NOW WILL BE LESS COSTLY THAN ONE LATER...

22 comments:

Damien said...

Pastorius,

Unfortunately at this point I don't think it would get enough support.

Natasha said...

I think...

we need to find out more about what spurred this...look at that interactive map, you posted a while back--and look at the Islam encroachment, around Russia,

and the fact that the Chechens, who have declared Jihad on the world, are assisting the forces in Georgia...

I'm not so sure to slam Russia at this time--its too familiar with what happened in the former Yugoslavia,

almost as if, its been set up to Get us, to react.

And all in the same weeks that China has been attacked as well, Not saying I am on Russia's side,

but I think there is just far more to this than what we are seeing in the media. Nationalist or not, whether Putin is an ass or not,

Something sinister is going on and Chechnya has been in this way before now, in Georgia that is...

with the elections coming up, with everything going on, now this?

Something is up, and my gut tells me, its something to do with Jihad...the Jihadists HATE Russia And China,

oh, and Turkey, Turkey has been selling arms to Georgia--whats up with that?

No, I think, what the US needs to do is not react, not now, and find out, what is going on and What is the strategy, and why Now?

Just too much, seems a lot like the former Yugoslavia, and look at Kosovo today...

look at that map, and look at the surrounding areas [and isn't it interesting, I did some analysis, the trafficking, from Latvia, etc. which is extremely bad,

low Muslim percentile BUT Finland, high Muslim percentile and GUESS WHERE THESE TRAFFICKED SLAVES ARE GOING?

FINLAND--they have a huge problem with it...remember, trafficking domestic workers/sex slaves, is ALL TIED INTO THE CARTELS AND BLACK MARKET FOR 'ARMS',

arms and drugs.

Now I could be way off on this, but, its just--well, a distraction almost--what better way the Jihadists would have, to pull us in, a confict,

with Israel right there...just something odd about it. the timing...

anyone else think so?

Natasha said...

let me rephrase that...it almost seems, that Russia and China, have been backing the devil--that alliance, sort of like the duped left is doing here--but all the while,
the Jihadists have slowly been encroaching on them both--the Islamists are NOT going to share power with Russia or China,

but at the same time--pull us into a war with Russia, that works for them--its like,

this tangled web, either way, I think, what the US needs to do, is back Israel--Can we afford war against Russia? At this time?

Russia obviously is expanding, obviously but why Chechnya assisting Georgia? Its like,

they're feeding the enemy with one hand and the other hand fighting the same enemy, I'll have to do a lot more reading on this but its just the timing...and Turkey's involvement--and the recent decisions in Russia to crack down on abortion,

I'm getting all sorts of versions on the Russian news sites, so its hard to sift, due to just the factions In Russia.

I know this much--WWIII

it sure the hell looks like this is it. Or the beginning of...but I'm no war expert so,

but it does seem--if we support Georgia that is going to strengthen the Russian-Iran alliance,

if we don't, that hurts us too. Either way,

it does NOT look good.

Damien said...

Natasha,

Than we might want to be careful here, the enemy of our enemy is not necessarily our friend.

Natasha said...

Well Damien,

I'm reading more on this, its one, confusing as hell, so That doesn't help--and I have to admit, its been about two years since I have been keeping up with the Russian papers [I studied Russian as part of my minor in college],

and, hell, just figuring Russia out, can be confusing as ever--due to just the internal factions, nationalists, religious nationalists, nazi nationalists, lenin-nazi nationalists [seriously they combined], the old commies, KGB, the Russian mafia's, the businesses, the pro-westerners, I mean,

and then they can merge too, and thats not Even including the Islamists in Russia and the surrounding former Soviet Bloc countries.

Russia has committed genocide in part in Chechnya too, some of the worst human right abuses towards boy children [just killing entire villages of boys] and rapes/tortures of women,

which of course, works to fuel the Jihadists, but then, if you look at the Russian side [their argument], the terrorism by the Jihadists--

and they aren't innocent by no means--and it gets to like,

Who in the hell to believe over there! Like Latvia I think, pro-west--also, very pro-Nazi, so,

hard to say really. No doubt, Russia, the government, is corrupt as hell...but the reports of genocide or ethnic cleansing of Russians in Georgia doesn't surprise me either.

But the arguments for supporting Georgia, have a lot of merit--my concern too though, is, I don't put a lot of weight on the 'joining NATO',

Turkey, joining EU--that Still doesn't change Turkey, Sure, business loves it--but is it good politically????

The Pro-West, yes, that is a strength that we need, those alliances--and the independent oil lines BUT

is it enough? Which, leaves me to the question, where is Europe in all this? Where do they stand?

Its sure to effect Europe just as much as America--Russia is a thorn, in the side without a shadow of a doubt--just their support of Iran,

is like this thumbing their noses--but too I just read a report that Russia is backing the Abkhazia forces, and I thought they were Islamists and supported by Chechnya?

So that doesn't make any sense...unless I got those facts wrong.

But I do think the Jihadists so have their dirty hands in this...with whats going on in China--the election, if Obama gets elected,

I wouldn't be surprised if Georgia is sacrificed, and Iran--

is no doubt gearing to strike--at us or Israel, its like,

what are waiting for?

But instead we let him in our country and let him spew his lies at one of our universities...I think, the days of diplomacy,


are OVER. Will say One thing for Russia--they don't fuck around do they? If only the US, would be a bit more like Russia--

maybe we wouldn't be in this mess right now.

Damien said...

Natasha,

Careful what you wish for. Russian Democracy is slipping away these days. From what I hear, Its getting harder and harder to criticize Putin there without the threat of punishment. That's a sign of an emerging dictatorship. Still we do need to get tough on the Jihad Monsters. They may be the biggest threat to human liberty the world has ever seen.

Anonymous said...

"AND THEN IMMEDIATELY THREATENED WITH MILITARY RETALIATION - BY THE USA AND NATO"

Why not launch the nukes immediately? :)

Russia had a casus belli to get involved:

a) Most of Ossetian and Abkhaz citizens have Russian passports, so its a duty of the Russia president to protect them;

b) During the previous conflict in early 90's Georgia already tried to subdue Ossetia by force - it failed. As a result both sides asked Russia to mediate peace. Both sides asked Russia to send in the peacekeeping force.

Under the agreement, Russia was obliged to prevent any side of the conflict from launching an attack. Had South Ossetia invaded Georgia (heh heh), Russia would have been obliged to protect Ossetia.

Now Georgia violated the treaty it signed, but not just that - it launched an attack in a well-planned blitzkrieg, leading to deaths of both Russian peacekeepers and Ossetian people (also citizens of Russia).

Russia has a damn good reason to make sure that Georgians don't do that yet again in the future. That would require, possibly, decimation of the Georgian armed forces. Or an extremely bloody nose for them. Something to make sure, that Saakashvilli won't be able to portray the results of the war as 'victory'.

And thank God, that Georgia wasn't allowed into NATO. It seems that Saakashvilli has been planning the attack all along.

moderationist said...

Georgia will rue the day it leaves the Soviet Union.
There's more here than meets the eye. What's happening in the Phillipines with islamofascism will start in Georgia and eventually it will be destroyed.

Epaminondas said...

There nothing to 'understand'.

If anything, Mexico could complain about the area from Santa Cruz to El Paso and the way their compatriots who 'hold' mexican passports are treated, then with a sufficiently armed nation enter the USA to 'protect' them.

Georgia was becoming a NATO ally. Geogia is a democratic ally. Georgia is an ally in Iraq WITH MEN ON THE GROUND.

And we have as much ability to protect them and help them militarily right now, as Britain and France did Poland in 1939.

NONE.

We don't have the infantry ability, which is what it would take. A division on the ground in Georgia would be a STOP LINE. One hundred Strike Eagles would be useful only to kill a lot of Russians, and start a REAL WAR

Any action by sea, or air would have to be backed by the willingness of the american people to enter REAL WAR with Russia.

I know no one who is.

NATO ground forces?
We have yet to even speak with our allies about this. Who would it be? The germans who don't allow their men to shoot or be shot at in afghanistan?

They HAVE us on this one unless we can use other pressure to halt them

Epaminondas said...

Moderationist... the Phillipines islamic issue has been around since the Spaniards and Magellan, and certainly in armed conflict since around 1898.

Anonymous said...

Think Balkans. Democracy is not always defined by a vote.

It's because of the doctrinal elements - Islam and Communism - that I prefer the sidelines on this one.

I don't side with Russia because I would do nothing to assist Putin's re-bastardization of Russia(why is he still calling the shots?).

God works in mysterious ways - perhaps this is his way of giving the west time to re-examine questionable alliances.

The West, in a misguided effort to recoup ME oil profits, sold (for decades and continues to sell) untold quantities of state-of-the-art arms and doodads to greased up nations mired in 7th century illusions of supremacist grandeur.

Recognizing decades of consequences to such folly should bring to what appears to be such a difficult decision - a bit of moral clarity.

Feeling abandoned . . .this 'muslim in name only'(MINO) country will feel betrayed and likely seek assistance from the umma. But will the umma respond in force? Not likely. Georgia will have to decide whether 'democracy', as they understand it, is worth the effort or follow in Chechnya's footsteps.

Putin may very well be quelling such deceptive alliances (Islam cleverly concealed under a convenient cloak of democracy)- neither of which serve his agenda.

Assistance from the umma, in and of itself, should dispell any notion of where deep seated loyalties rooted in the foundation of Islam will always revert.

Sarajevo's ethnic cleansing is complete within two decades. "How long" or "why" would/could/should Russia evade such 'democracy'?

moderationist said...

First let's find out which side harbors the soulless butchers of 400 plus schoolchildren. The soulless butchering of small children is nothing compared to what Georgia has in store for it. There's more here than meets the eye.

Epaminondas said...

What kind of conflation is going on here ..or am I missing something?

Georgia has nothing to do either with Beslan or the Balkans.

Georgia was invaded and taken over in 1921-24 by the USSR and is now free again.

They were well into the process of joining NATO.

THAT
IS
IT

There IS nothing else.

moderationist said...

I beg to differ. There is far more to this than meets the eye. Freedom to be butchered by soulless islamofascists is not a freedom I would wish on anyone.

Natasha said...

Did some reading on the background,

seems that this isn't the first time there has been problems or ethnic cleansing in this region,

92--there was war between Georgia and
Abkhazia and South Ossetia--ethnic cleansing of Georgians, ethnic cleansing of Ossetians, of Abkhazians, and on and on,

back and forth, all THREE EXTREMELY NATIONALIST,

and both Ossetia and Abkhazia have minority Muslim populations--now where this is aiding in stirring tensions, don't know, from what I've been able to gather this has more to do with

'reclaiming' regions by ethnicity since the fall of the Soviet Union, and Georgia has not been innocent apparently--

guess in 92 there was a mass ethnic cleansing against Georgians in Abhkazia, ceasefire signed in 94, and Ossetia--apparently large counterfeiting ring,

and interestingly, no Jews since 89--run out maybe?

So--yea, it seems there is WAY MORE THAN MEETS THE EYE here,

and this has been a conflict back and forth since the 90s from what I can tell--but the tensions go all the way back since prior to Communism,

and, surprisingly, Both separatist regions are majority Christian, but then, Chechnya is involved--

so it looks as if this is ethnic hatred/nationalist [or ultra-nationalism] and separatism

being utilized by Jihadists, and Russia/a.k.a. Putin wants iron fist control for resources, and also for strategic and security reasons...

on Russian forums there is A LOT of anger at Americans who are on the boards and basically what I'm seeing is,

America stay out, America is in two illegal wars and is in no position to say anything to Russia, that seems to be the consensus,

on all three sides from the nationalists from what I can tell,

[this is what I'm seeing on the Russian forums] AND some are saying it wasn't Russia that invaded but that it was Ossetia that started it, and back and forth,

etc etc etc

whichever, if we support Georgia we risk going to war with Russia in a full blown way, with the 'deals' between Russia and Iran--

that works big time against us--though I think it would depend on Europe's reaction,

if we Don't support Russia, we still aid in the power hegemony of Russia and then to Iran--

that and Georgia assisting the US in Iraq--thats almost an obligation To do something--

and I'm sure the jihadists are aware of this. The international community does not recognize either separatists as nation-states, or as independents--

[sure if they were 100%-or even 50% muslim that would be a different story eh--then it would be support against ole Russia]

maybe what the US Should do, is remove any and/or all support from Russia in their war against Chechnya--they want to lie in bed,

let them reap the fruits.

you know two can play that game. it might be time for the US to play really dirty,

Russia and China are--let them have their damn Islam.

Sometimes I can't help but to think, especially when I read the extreme American Hate on other forums [international],

fine--they hate America so much and want Islam--

fucking LET THEM HAVE IT.

and in the meantime--deport the muslims here, secure our borders, and mass up the military IN THIS COUNTRY, and throw up an iron wall just like the Soviets did,

nationalist, you bet ya, but it seems the more this country tries to aid and assist, the more its used to hate us and to destroy us.

Epaminondas said...

What are you people talking about...after the USSR took over Georgia in 1924 they forced thousands of Russians into South Ossetia. THAT is what this is about. Georgia freed itself after the USSR collapsed, and like Ukrainians have moved steadily towards real democracy. Their president today is educated HERE. They were becoming NATO member.

If someone has reliable information this somehow is about islamists

LETS
SEE
THE
URL'S

This is Hungary or Kuwait, not Chechnya.

RED HERRINGS

Epaminondas said...

HERE

HERE

HERE

Damien said...

Epaminondas,

I'm sorry, but your first link doesn't work. The other two work, just fine.

Epaminondas said...

sorry about that:

here

Damien said...

Epaminondas,

Thanks for sending us the working link.

Damien said...

Anonymous,

Okay, who ever you are, enlighten us then.

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